Why do people keep mentioning battleship sniping like it was actually something you can do in this game

Getting a little defense there eh? Try running a Dual rep Hyperion with a single cap booster bro, it's not stable. You want a dual rep setup to work with a single injector then the cap consumption of Large reppers is going to have to be reduced.

There is already sentry drones doctrines.

Gallente ships are generally the worst ships in game. So what do we do with the best Drone boat in class? Nerf it and make the Amarr drone boat better.

yeah, because they have been turned into Gallente...

Just take a look at the Armageddon, it is now a Dominix / Bhaalghorn hybrid that resembles the Typhoon.

domi is not going to change... its the new king slowcat... personally i am in love with it...

as for the mega... i would think a better rate of fire bonus and remove one gun so that its 6 turrets one utility high slot and then add back a low... i would like to see the tracking bonus replaced with a falloff but hey i can live without it...
now you can shield tank it and go nuts with nano or proper armor tank it... plus think nuetrons with null with a 50% increase in falloff?!?!?

as for the hype?
i would increase the damage bonus and reduce to 6 turrets take away a high slot and replace with a mid slot. include a cap activation redcution for the armor bonus...
so you now would have 7 high slots 6 turret
5 mid slots and 7 low slots...

true that i mean i can use sentry drones at 150km and do great dps...

surely you can use nuets out to that range and would not be a waisted bonus if you tried a simular setup on the geddon

As for the new Armageddon... I think you're overestimating the ship quite a bit.
SET of neuting bonuses? Let's be clear It has one and that's range.
That means you're getting a MAXIMUM of 38km neuting range (without faction gear) on a battleship that has 4 mid slots, destructible damage (drones), and an almost guaranteed passive tank.

It does not have a neut AMOUNT bonus like the Bhaalgorn, so stop making comparisons to it.
A Bhaalgorn will remove more cap than it takes to activate its neut. That (in addition to its capacitor) is why it does its job well.
The Armageddon is not that. If that were the case, you would have been seeing people using Neut Domis left right and center instead of the Bhaalgorns that everyone loves.

This.

BTW, there is now a LAAR which increase your burst active tank by a lot for more than one minute.

still saying the bonus for the domi should be this:

Gallente Battleship Skill Bonuses:
+10% Drone Damage , Drone hitpoints , Drone optimal range and Drone tracking speed
+5% to drone activation range and sentry drone damage

dont think you get how good the domi would be if that were its bonuses...

- When using sentries you aren't moving (unless you are willing to lose your sentries). The extra mobility that the Domi has over the Geddon is lost.

No, the biggest problem with the domi is the drones...

-Arazel

anywho those bonus i already said would be op on a tech I ship... but not on a revamped Sin.

Do you feel a single type of drone retains comparable advantages and versatility to a single type of turret?

Maybe that's because you can't stockpile drones in your dronebay like you can ammo in your cargohold. If you lose 5 heavy/sentry drones in a Dominix... it hurts. You only have enough drone space for 2 extra sets of heavy/sentry drones... but realistically you only carry 1 extra set because you need light and utility drones "just in case." Consciously losing drones (and thus DPS) left and right as a tactic is not what I consider very smart (nor cheap).

I might be asking for a bit much here, but 1k drone bay for the Dominix would leave plenty of utility and offensive room for drones.
I guess I kind of think of drone ships like a tool box, but right now you can only fit 3 screwdrivers in the whole thing.

New versions of Hyperion and Megathron posted in the OP - let me know what you guys think.

to move towards a completely dedicated gun boat.

2 plates 2 eanm and a dc? Is not a solid tank?

On the launcher thing. They do have uses, and giving the Hyperion alternative options is fine. Not everybody takes battleships out solely to blob 300 by 300 people at a time.

[Megathron, Pure-Brawler]
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Damage Control II

100MN Afterburner II
Warp Scrambler II
Stasis Webifier II
Tracking Computer II, Tracking Speed Script

Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
[empty high slot]

Large Hybrid Burst Aerator I
Large Anti-Explosive Pump I
Large Anti-Explosive Pump I

1019 DPS at 8,8 km with 0.09937 of tracking. And you can even have another low slot (don't know if more buffer or other EANM). 63037 of EHP, but it's attack role, not combat role. THIS is the right way :)

Slot layout: 7H(-1), 4M, 8L(+1); 7 turrets , 0 launchers(-2)
Fittings: 15500 PWG, 570 CPU(+20)
Defense (shields / armor / hull): 6300(+89) / 6500(-141) / 7500
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second): 5800(+175) / 1087s / 5.02 (+.15)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 122(+7) / .117(-.0046) / 98400000 / 15.96s (-.63s)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 75(-50) / 75(-50)
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 72.5km / 95 / 7
Sensor strength: 21 Magnetometric Sensor Strength
Signature radius: 380(-20)

No need for apologies, just here to have some good debate.


On the web bonus topic, the bonus would at max level bring the web strength back to the original 90%. This would allow the Mega the ability to keep the target locked down and being able to properly apply dps by making tracking easier.

I'm not sure how that extra 30% to a single targeted ship would completely upset the game balance. If you could get into more details why that would cause a complete game imbalance, I'd be happy to give it a second thought. Personally I think there is no single bonus that could be considered the best as all fights in eve are situational. There a lot of great b onuses such as, EW strength, neutralizer range, warp disruptor range, etc.

Also I'm curious as to why you feel the web would have more of an impact everywhere else over null sec. An explanation here would be appreciated!

Kiting with blasters is like swordfighting with bayonets.

That's also a good option. I think more so for the scrambler than the disruptor though.

Where is is the Electronic Warfare Bonus on the Dominix like on the scorpion or armageddon ?? !!!

OK I'm not very happy with the Hyperion I suggested in retrospect. I think the original CCP proposal for the Hyperion might have been OK if they added a bonus to armour rep capacitor use (in addition to repair amount) so that you could run two reps with a single injector.

OMG their has to be a consequence for your actions so obviously no you are not going to be stable ( however 2 x LAR's = 800 GJ over 15 seconds standard over the 10 seconds your injector cycles so if you are not shooting you can be stable injecting cap 800's ) you want to shoot MWD point and so on then something has to suffer.

I also think you're nerfing the drone use of the megathron too harshly, it should keep 125mbit bandwidth and 125m3 bay, drones ARE other Gallente weapons after all. The other changes to the Gal lineup are pretty aces though

I personally feel that all active tanking bonuses should come with a 4% or 5% reduction in cap consumption of armor/shield reppers per level.

didn't they say 6 5 7 ?

CCP
Is there any chance of getting that lowslot moved to a mid on the megathron at all i think the option to shield tank nano it is its best option since it has the worst range and tank of all battleships?... oo and all attack bs need much more mobility?

Also a lot more EHP is needed surely the double HP each class of ship should be followed here....

Yes because rokhs are so mobile and do tons of dps :P

The problem of Gallente is, to be precise, this: they are blaster boats, dependent of the range more than other platforms, and they are armor boats. And with armor boats the best fits (for EHP purposes) are those that slow down the speed (you know, Pumps, 1600mm's and stuff like that). My fitting some pages ago, that don't slow down the speed for this attack Mega, only have <75K EHP, kind of ridiculous. In addition, they were not the fastest ships. I think they have done a great advance rising up the velocity of the Gallente boats, but Dominix. Maybe the Hyperion is still slow being a blaster boat. But Dominix is the rare ship in this situation.

+7.5% Large Hybrid Turret tracking speed and Large Hybrid Turret falloff per Level.
+ 7.5% ( +10% would make it fall more inline with the Armageddon E-war bonus that everyone is so concerned about ) bonus to Warp Scrambler and Warp Disruptor range per level.

The problem of this will be that you will have a cheap copy of an old Minmatar BS, with a Neutron Blaster Cannon II at lvl5 with 13,75 km of Falloff. And less tank as they don't use cap and can use it all for the XL-SB

1) They Hyper is fine but the Rep bonus needs to be changed. I have seen some great ideas such as MWD/AB speed increase, Web Range increase, Scram range increase, or even a Falloff/Optimal range bonus. The current rep bonus really does exclude this ship from fleets and needs to be changed. (if you like a tank bonus just make it have resist bonuses)

2) The Mega it seems that most people really want to have 5 Mids instead over the 8 lows (this will make it able to be fit in ship doctrines). To offset the loss of required 3rd Mag Stab to put the ship back where it was in DPS it will need get back more drones. The new ROF bonus though seems good also comes with huge cap problems and this needs to be addressed along with CPU issues. I have also seen some recommendations about changing the tracking bonus with falloff/optimal bonus and web range bonuses. Simply put, this is the most iconic Gallente ship and really time and effort needs to be made in making it useful. It was the BS that made me want to play the game all those years ago.

The changes are getting there but we need some more tweaks. I have not seen a Gallente BS in any fleet doctrines that I know of and we need to change this.

I mean that to have a cheap and bad copy of a Minmatar BS you better maintain the role of the Gallente, so you forget, as you have said, the RoF bonus they are thinking to put.

See that all these pages have been to discuss the slots question.

you better give what the people demands in the slots matter and problem solved.

The 8 highs will give the possibility to fit 7 weapons and the utility slot that all the people is talking about being removed in the Mega. Why maintain the 7 weapons system if you now have more speed? For the nerfed damage of the drones.

Actually, no. No they don't. You are fixated on an arbitrary number that means nothing.

Then either drive them a Drone per level ( and the bandwidth to use it ), or another idea would be to let them fit the same mod Carriers use for additional drones/fighters ( this would be ideal if turret points remained, then you'd need to choice between more drones or turrets.. not or on the flipside, more drones, less drone control range).

Having a single ship that can fit the Drone Control Units (via role bonus) and changing the +optimal range bonus to perhaps a range increase for RR would make for some interesting fits. You could RR your sentries or a spider tanked BS fleet again. Sounds like fun gameplay to me.

I had read other BS threads seeing updates to bonuses based on feed back, so I excitedly hopped over here hoping, praying something would have been done about the hyperion's worthless armor bonus.

Don't oversell it. The Maelstrom is the "premier fleet ship" because it has ridiculously high alpha, and in an age of TiDi that is the premier fleet tactic and reason for the Mael's success. The Mael does it the best--it has nothing to do with its repair bonus, lost as it is or not.

Right..... lets compare shall we?

Vigilant -
slot layout - 5 / 4 / 6 (5 turrets)
bonuses - 75% damage / falloff and web bonus.
drones - 50 bandwith / 50 cap

Thorax -
Slot layout - 5 / 4 / 5 (5 turrets)
bonuses - 5% damage / 7.5% tracking
drones - 50 band / 50 cap

So vigi has more damage BY FAR. and ability to nano with falloff bonus or brawl with extra low slot by only really a passive option. Otherwise they are similar but vigi still better.



Now Battleships -

Vindicator -
slots - 8 / 5 / 7 (8 turrets)
Bonuses - 37.5% damage / tracking and web bonus
Drones - 125 band / 125 cap

Hyperion - (purposed changes)
slots 7 / 5 / 7 (6 turrets)
Bonuses - 10% Hybrid per level / 7.5% armor rep per level.
Drones - 125 Band / 175 cap

So - unless Im wrong ..... 8 turrets bonused one time 37.5% is similar to 6 turrets bonused at 10% per level. Not only that, but the slot layout both mids and lows are identical. Meaning you can place the same tank on both....... but wait Hyp gets an armor rep bonus too.. Making its Tank MUCH better than the vindis. Also the hyp now gets a full flight of Heavy drones, but also gets room for mediums and or lights with a larger bay. At least both have to use all highs for turrets for full DPS output....... oh wait thats right they gave the hyp an utility high slot too.


Now explain to me again just how the thorax and vigi comparison is the same as the hyp / vindi? Cause the way im looking at this is that the vigilant still has options, nano range ... or an exltra low for a bigger buffer tank. This new Hyp make the Vindi a completely obsolete piece of ****. This new hyp is broken!

If anything, I'm worried this is too strong, but it should be an extremely fun ship to use. Hope you guys approve.

You really ought to play this game before commenting on it.

First, carriers have 15 drones with the DCUs. The Domi would have 10 total. Carriers can use fighters. And I'm pretty sure the main reason to fly a carrier anyway is for triage. By your terrible logic, no ships could have bonuses any other has.

Second, ships that have dual bonuses to damage are still usable in small gangs. Ships that have a resist bonus and a damage bonus are usable by small gangs. And the argument for the removal of the local repair bonus is twofold: local armor tanking is cap intensive and performs poorly. There isn't an ASB module that armor tanked ships can fit that makes them cap-independent for tank.

Also, "stupidly large" fights aren't the push for getting rid of the local bonus or having it apply to remote reps. Again, you'd know this if you actually played the game. The main reason is that as soon as you introduce logi into a gang or fleet, which is ridiculously easy now with T1 logi, the local bonus is COMPLETELY wasted. So the argument becomes why fly a ship with one bonus when I can fly one with two?

Some experience, even a modest amount, in the field and you might actually have enough to speak credibly here.

You really ought to play this game before commenting on it.

First, carriers have 15 drones with the DCUs. The Domi would have 10 total. Carriers can use fighters. And I'm pretty sure the main reason to fly a carrier anyway is for triage. By your terrible logic, no ships could have bonuses any other has.

And the argument for the removal of the local repair bonus is twofold: local armor tanking is cap intensive and performs poorly. There isn't an ASB module that armor tanked ships can fit that makes them cap-independent for tank.

just as a proper T2 logi ship will have both range and repair amount over the Domi with a proposed logi range bonus.

But why you're talking about triage and a Niddy (being repped?) in 2.4 seconds or...f**k it, I can't make sense of nonsense.

Ah cool links! Woo! Instead of watching all those YouTube videos and wishing you were as good as those pilots, you should actually play the game, learn about what you're talking about, then you can post here without sounding like an idiot.

This only further shows how uninformed you are at this game. The Devs themselves have even stated that armor tanking is in a terrible state. At this point, you're just embarrassing yourself more with every post.

This is just pure crap NO T2 logi ship gets an RR module amount bonus only the niddy gets a 5% to Shied and armor RR amount it is all range bonus hence encroaching on logistic ships bonusGÇÖs and iGÇÖm such a failure ???
The T1's get one to make them more viable.

Wow, you are bad. Typical Oneiros repair amount per 5 sec cycle: 1886. Comparably-fit Dominix repair amount per cycle: 1711. Whoa! 1886 > 1711, or ~10%. Numbers are hard. See that? The T2 Logi ship reps for more.

I know you're going to ask, because ship fitting is probably incomprehensible to you, but here you go (the important bits): 4x Large 'Solace' Remote Bulwark Reconstruction and 5x Medium Repair Drone II s. Because of those drones, the dedicated Logi ship experiences a ten percent buff over the non-buffed repair amount of the unbonused Domi. Now you see how bad it is to waste a bonus?

I'm truly sorry that you don't know how to play Eve, yet you feel compelled to try and "prove" to everyone reading this that you can. :-/ At this point, I see no reason to continue to respond to your stupidity. Have fun with it. I'm sure you'll respond and "get me," but oh well. Can't fix stupid, not even with bonuses.

Yes a shield tanked mega with a utility high allows it to serve its attack role properly although i still think it needs more speed and agility but at least with nanos you can get somewhere but a dual plated/trimarked version is just a slow brick with pitiful range. that most things can outrange and outmaneuver.

Well lets put this another, how is the mega is an attack battleship when the Hype is faster after you've fitted plates?
If you plated both ships the Hyperion would have more buffer so its better as a plated combat ship... so whats the point in a plated mega?....
At least a shield mega offers you something different ... lots of speed a tanky Talos if you will..

shakes head..... i can read speed/mass stats in an OP ... i was referring to Hype being optimally fit i.e. armour reps/rep rigs as no speed penalty and mega then plated/trimarked.
As you're not going to plate a Hyperion as you wouldn't plate a mega if you could shield tank it properly with 5 or 6 mids.

And 5 mid slots does not a shield tanked battleship make.

3) Domi, WTF huge nerf. Who is actually wanting a DRONE sniper ship that you can't move with. Terrible. Please also change the graphics for this ship maybe 1% like it and others refuse to fly it because its so silly looking.